[00:00:00] Adam: I, wanted to come here because I felt like where I was in the UK, there wasn’t like that much for me.
there is that aspect of it where at a certain stage in your life and you get the right opportunity and you can grab it, the bull by the horns and make it your own.
[00:00:17] Scott: Hi there and welcome to made it in Thailand, the podcast where we learn how to thrive in Thailand from top performers who have found success in the kingdom. I’m your host, Scott Pressmone. Today I am speaking with Adam Porteous. Adam is going to share his journey from a small village in England to becoming the head of sales for a marketing agency in Bangkok.
Without further ado, let’s jump into the interview.
[00:00:40] Scott: Adam. Thank you so much for joining me today on Made it in Thailand. So how about we kick off by just a quick introduction, who you are, what you do, where you’re from, started there.
[00:00:53] Adam: Yeah, so my name’s Adam Porteous. I’m originally from a town in Cheshire in England, which is just, south of Manchester. I’m 34 years old. I moved to Thailand, about four to five years ago, and I currently work for a marketing agency called Pronto Marketing, and I’m the head of sales there.
[00:01:16] Scott: Fantastic. we’ve known each other for a few years now. I’m not too familiar with your background and what you were doing before you came to Thailand. and can you share a little bit more about that background?
[00:01:30] Adam: Yeah, sure. I think the first time we met you were interviewing me, if I was correct, or at least you, You were a fly on the wall as other people were interviewing me until I got the role. But yeah, I moved to Thailand four to five years ago, having just spent, around six to nine, maybe even a full year traveling around Southeast Asia and doing something in between, which I’ll talk later about, a semi entrepreneurial attempt.
and yeah, where it all started in regards to, from a marketing perspective, as I used to do. Like journalism was where I initially started studying and that sort of moved into them towards like more marketing and communications. And then with the nature of the job market, after financial crisis, you just take whatever roles were available and digital marketing and, SEO and all these other things were basically at the forefront of, marketing now, traditional and print was dying out, which is why I’ve pivoted from journalism and into.
Like communications and things like this and then from there It evolved into doing different roles at different companies both overseas and in the uk freelance positions and so yeah, really like a passion for english and writing that pushed me towards marketing now. I’m in a sales role and again, I think with the way sales has even changed that maybe 20, 30, 40 years ago, it was a bit more, probably less consultative and more bushy and more direct.
And now there’s a bigger like blurring of the lines between account management and sales and all these different types of facets and different industries and what these things entail. And so I almost feel like having just expertise in a field can allow you to move into sales if you’ve got the skills.
Other attributes that align with basically being sales oriented or goal oriented.
[00:03:34] Scott: The lines are blurring and Communication is one of those soft skills that you can do anything with. And especially if you build up sales skills as you have, it’s that’s probably the most empowering skillset to have because everyone has to sell either themselves or, or a product or service.
And I think you’ve built up a skillset. I didn’t know that it was all grounded in a background in journalism though. So that kind of explains why you can also do stuff like copy and whatnot, and web copy and, and stuff. I still want to get a better feel for your background. So the fact that you were studying.
studying journalism. did you, know what you wanted to do back in your university days or
[00:04:12] Adam: I, feel like I, I had an idea of the sectors or types of expertise that I was interested in. Like I was a pretty decent student, a little bit mischievous, like people can all be, but I would get good grades. I was in the highest sets, but I definitely found things like science and More challenging, there was like Einstein’s in this class and I’d be the sort of person like look knows the right homework, see if I can pinch an answer or understand how they figured something out.
Whereas with English and other things, I felt like there was less shackles in a way from a creative standpoint. obviously you can be creative in how you can solve a problem, but objectively there’s like more of a science behind it. And it was always enjoyed reading. My mom and dad used to read a lot and then I would pick up their books when we would go on holidays.
And so I think as I was younger, I would just gravitate towards, like the literacy. And then, when I was at sixth form, which is different to how they do it in the States, you guys go to 18 and leave, whereas we go to 16 and then we do what’s called A Levels, or it could be B Tech, vocational, where you specialize in three subjects.
And then I gamed the system, because I knew English lit was going to be hard and English language was going to be hard and lit was somewhat interesting but loads of it was really like deep anthology type works and then there was media studies and I thought oh cool this is going to be more like video and script writing and stuff and it wasn’t really because the school was I guess not like a media specialist school and so you’d be like watching things like Scream or something and then You know, doing a bit of an analysis on it, but it was a type of subject where you could get easier grades.
So that’s why I was talking about game in the system. Then I did PE, which again, game in the system, because part of it was a practical assessment. I was good at football and rugby and stuff like this. So I guess maybe I was always had a psychological element, and going into that, which helps you with sales.
but yeah, I didn’t really have a set idea of what I wanted to do. I just didn’t know why I did it. You know what I mean? And so then I picked media studies, which led to journalism at Sheffield Hallam. And then after one year, I actually transferred to America. And then that’s where another part of my story also begins.
[00:06:44] Scott: I’ve always known you as a really hard worker, right? So you, always will get the job done. You’ll grind, you’ll do whatever you need to do. And it reminds me of that sort of persona of, someone who will learn the really, complicated way to cheat on a test.
Like you’re putting in all the work on learning how to cheat on the test. so you’re, showing your smarts, but it’s like a matter of not being confined to following this exact track, doing it this exact way, find the way around it. while still not doing it in the lazy way in a way, cause you’re, yeah, you’re working
[00:07:12] Adam: And it can be like teachers as well, right? it’s if you’ve got a football manager who’s like Jose Mourinho, that guy’s going to make you laugh. Run miles and miles down the pitch. And then you can have a different type of manager. He’s a bit more laissez faire and lets express yourself.
And so depending on the type of play, you might feel like, how do I go and work for that person? Cause they’re going to make me, run my ass off. And I think there was teachers I just avoided because I’d already, they’d already teach me. It wasn’t like I was a bad student per se, but there was maybe some, as I said, being mischievous in my youthful days, so I was just like, I’m going to take the easiest, the path to least resistance, and, while still being within something that I have an interest in, that’s how I would
[00:07:59] Scott: For sure. So now touching on, Traveling to the U S and doing the studying abroad. I’m curious how, many of your, friends and whatnot did the study abroad thing? Was that fairly common or, were you a bit of an outlier, in deciding to travel to America?
[00:08:17] Adam: it was really, it was almost something, in fact, I actually clicked on a Google ad, interestingly enough, that started all this, so maybe that was my, leading to marketing at all, it would be. to a sales pitch, but yeah, the, what happened was I was playing football soccer, at reasonably good level for the age.
It was like amateur. I was playing at like county standard. I’d never had trials, but I would school team went to like third in the nationals. I’ll say 1600 teams in the country. And so we were, pretty decent team regionally and nationally. And then I was going to go to uni in Sheffield. I just started, I was trying to find a semi pro team and I started Googling around, I can’t remember exactly how it happened, but I must’ve Googled like maybe something around scholarships or something about semi professional or trials, and then that Google ad popped up and then it was like, go study abroad in America and to apply, I think it was free or you paid like something like nominal, like 50, 40 pounds or whatever, something to play in this trial.
And then there would be an agent fee that you’d pay if you got accepted into the program. And so I was the only kid that did it because no one else was searching this. It wasn’t like your coaches told you like, Hey, there’s all these kids going to America to go and do this thing. And so it was purely just off the cuff and spontaneous.
And then I got through these different, like two rounds of trials and everyone that I was like, I played at QPI, I played at Arsenal, I scored a winning goal in the number 14 FA Cup. I was like, I’ll play with my mates in the street. equivalent.
[00:10:03] Scott: No shoes.
[00:10:04] Adam: yeah, and but I think that was that kind of just, I didn’t want anyone to try and take that away from me based on they had some sort of calibre.
And at the end of the day, I’d played against good players. And I knew what my, I felt my standard was. And so I had a good, couple of good games I got through. And then it all started from there, but there was definitely not, it wasn’t something that was widespread despite there being loads of kids at this trial.
I don’t think it was something that was common. maybe at the academies that the kids that got released and maybe had decent enough GCSEs, they would maybe give them the elbow and be like, Hey, you could go and apply to go play university in the MLS and then you could go that path.
So I reckon That is probably how a lot of those kids end up there and I just stumbled across it, which is why I don’t think many of my friends did it. But I think there was probably, definitely a few that had the caliber to, to go and do it for sure.
[00:11:03] Scott: So that’s interesting. It’s not at all the, what I was expecting to hear. cause I knew people like some, sometimes I’d say people in Europe will be like, Oh yeah, I studied in Milan or whatever for six months or took a semester there. And like the majority of them do that. But this did not seem like the common thing for people in your village to be doing.
and not only was it, Maybe it sounds like a little bit of a rarity of studying abroad, but it was studying abroad, through, through sport, through a Google ad, which is really interesting. how, first off, like how did, your friends or your family treat that first time that you were going abroad?
was that relatively again, rare, in, your village and whatnot to do something like that?
[00:11:42] Adam: Yeah, it was, obviously really credit to my parents because they, supported me, both in terms of like finances to pay the agent for you and I wanted to do all that. Effectively then get scholarship offers, supported part of my university fees. So I really owe credit to my parents for being, understanding and then also like financially supporting part of it that, I’d say the scholarship didn’t cover, but I did get a pretty decent ride.
And then for my friends, it was like, like mixed, I think there was a couple where it was all like, Oh, why didn’t I think of that? cause they would like good enough players probably. But, most people were supportive and thought it was interesting. I think the funny thing was when I had to, I ended up with two offers.
One was for Miami and one was Wisconsin. And then obviously I ended up going to like Wisconsin. People just like they didn’t even know where, like some of you generally wouldn’t know where Wisconsin was. Like I actually knew because of watching that 70s show. Great show. But, like other people may, yeah, not had such knowledge of Wisconsin prior to that.
[00:12:55] Scott: when you said that, I was just imagining, I didn’t know that 70 show was recorded or it was, it’s supposed to be based in Wisconsin, but my, thought was the TV shows are the things that you know, from Miami, like Miami vice or whatever else. So like people have Robin know Miami, but you just happen to be a guy that watched that 70 show.
how was that, was that landing on the ground, in Wisconsin? anything surprising about, About that you found surprising about the U S that was a little bit different than the movies or whatever,
[00:13:22] Adam: Oh, the first day I arrived was horrendous. Because all self induced by my own idiocy. Actually, peer pressure as well was a part of life. But, my friend had a free house, as we would call it back in the day. Which is where, parents are out. And he had, like, this kid was like, he had his own business.
And so it was the day before I was going, and I was like adamant I wasn’t drinking a lot. And then actually, we just had a few beers. And then there’s this one point that you all peer pressured me to drink what was like, you ever heard of Pimms? And so I had to like, in, drink a whole bottle of Pimms in one go.
and so then I was just in, in a bad way, basically. Ended up with like my phone got lost and it was like phone bills that were outrageous was basically nearly sick in the airport and then my mom and dad are like taking me away and then I land in Chicago or I get to Ireland and then the visa people are harassing me because it’s my first time going to America with this f1 visa whatever it was called and so yeah the first 24 hours were not something that were that great everything after that was It was great.
When I actually got to Chicago and the family picked me up, the Snows, they were a great family. Tom Snow was the left winger on our football team. And it was actually me and, another lad called, James Lockley, and we, arrived there and then he got picked up later by the manager in Wisconsin, but we stayed in Chicago O’Hare for one night.
And then we just, went around the mall and. Did all the kind of things that you would do in America. And I’ve been to the States before. I’ve actually done a football tour in California. My parents had took us on holiday there. But this was like me on my own, in my, what was just probably 19 soon to be turning 20.
So more like a young, adult. and yet more like integration with other, it wasn’t like I’m a tourist on a holiday, right? It’s like I’m just staying at family’s house. Or about, their city and the Cubs and the hockey team that was popular. Was it Hawks? I can’t remember now. So yeah, it was good.
It was great. minus the, hangover and all the issues that I brought upon myself. But yeah.
[00:15:53] Scott: Yeah, I feel like a lot has changed since then. I’ve known you when you’ve been in your, later years, but that sounds like the typical like 18, 19 year old sort of mistakes to me.
[00:16:03] Adam: Yeah, it’s not, especially with my friends as well. I was never going to be able to just have a few cans of Fosters and slunk off into the night. yeah.
[00:16:13] Scott: And then did you go anywhere else? So you were, in Wisconsin for a while. did you travel elsewhere, in the
U
[00:16:20] Adam: yeah. So when I was living there, we, especially in the offseason, for football season, we would actually travel to places to play games because we were in the, I can’t remember what it was called, but it was basically around like Iowa, Michigan, or like the Midwest region in Illinois. And then you would play your league games as well as Wisconsin.
You play your league games and then you would play in Minnesota. You play league games. And you play friendly games that would be arranged either during preseason or in periods where maybe you didn’t have league matches to keep like match fitness or just to contribute to your, overall record. It’s weird.
It’s like how friendlies used to be in the, international football before they created this, league of football nations. Because people would get in the system and have, loads of friendlies against, like Teams that were weaker to pull their points average up and you could do the same thing with the collegiate sports that were like not the big because we were NAIA which is different from NCAA. NAIA you can get a lot more foreigners in whereas NCAA have restrictions on usually how many foreigners and the way The scholarships are appropriated.
So there tends to be In the NAIA, for example, you may go travel to the team in what was it, like Lake Superior or something like this, like really far up north in Michigan. And they had, I think the coach was Brazilian, and so they had a Brazilian sort of core. Like they had Americans, but like a large portion of the team were Brazilian.
So yeah, we traveled to loads of different places, and it was interesting. We’d play these teams, and they would maybe be like a Scandi manager with a bunch of Danish and Norwegians. So in our case, it would be Brits, and we had Scottish. And English lads and the Welsh lads and then a couple from some other countries around Europe as well.
But, yeah, we’d be in in the Midwest and then just be like a little flock of, people from Norway or England or something. This is interesting in
[00:18:27] Scott: So if you had to, if you had to go back to America, you were forced to go back to America. I’m not saying you didn’t have a good time there, but let’s say today you had to go back. What, area do you think you would actually want to, stay? Which area did you enjoy the most?
[00:18:41] Adam: now really popular. I did go to Florida, which I liked and having now lived in Thailand and dealt with the tropical weather. maybe not the hurricanes and all the other stuff, but, now I can deal with the humidity. I’ve always really loved California for the, climate and, the, terrain around the different regions from south to north.
and I’ve got lots of friends in Colorado and I love skiing, so I would probably feel like I would end up on the Colorado, California side, but I think Texas could be interesting because I don’t think I’d live in the Midwest because the weather is terrible, but it’s really lush. the fall season is beautiful, but the winter is just unbearable.
Minus 40, it’s not for the faint hearted. You in
[00:19:40] Scott: I guess you, you traveled enough to see the differences just because, I’m from the east coast and, yeah, it’s drastically different. West coast is drastically different. Rust Belt is drastically different, right? there’s a, you can find whatever weather and, politics or whatever else that you want throughout America.
You’re going to different states, different areas. so it sounds like you got to, see a lot of that now. yeah. Yeah, not too far from Baltimore. So I grew up in between Baltimore and Washington DC. even those two are quite, different, right? If you
[00:20:09] Adam: Yeah, I’ve been to D, I’ve been to D. C. I’ve not been to Baltimore. I’ve been to Philly. I’ve been to the Jerseys. I was actually working around in New Jersey and New York region as well. So I have got some, East Coast experience. I actually like the East Coast as well. The reason I like the East Coast, it reminds me a little bit of, it’s just like the directness and sometimes the bluntness of that.
I actually find it like amusing in some regards. It reminds me. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:20:42] Scott: something I mean, I guess that now segue into Thailand a little bit since we’re both now in Thailand and I, feel like we’ve both found, good success here. but I think the background is really relevant. The fact that you’re, I didn’t know this about you. The fact that you had traveled, the fact that you had clicked a Google ad and we’re like, Oh, maybe I’ll try this.
it sounds like you, you are up for potentially challenging situations, Or, taking long shots or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. So I’m curious then if you fast forward into the deciding to move to Thailand, what was the story behind what you were doing right before that? And then, what inspired you to, make that leap to, to move to Thailand?
[00:21:16] Adam: Yeah. So before I went, moved to Thailand and before, in fact, I was traveling around Asia, which was like the catalyst for seeing if I could be employed in Asia, much like I was in the States. was I had been working at a large reseller of IT technology. and then I started working freelance for them and actually planned to go travel into Asia.
And then they said, Hey, we’ve got this big project and we know you’re planning to leave. But would you be interested in basically seeing this concept that I put forward right before I resign? They were like, yeah, we really this and we want to implement it, but we don’t have the people in house to do it.
And we’re going to have to replace you. And so we’re going to have all these, the music piece of the jigsaw. So would you consider doing this for say six months and we’ll pay you freelance and you just manage the project, as you will obviously pay you more because it’s freelance. And so for me, this was, my friends were all mocking me because I’ve been talking about going traveling because they’d all done it years before.
And, I kept putting it off, like another year, Oh, I’m just going to take this job because it’s got a pay rise or it’s got a, it’s Which I actually don’t regret doing now because I think everything fell the way it should, but they were just mocking me because now I had another reason to push it back.
But I think that freelance thing again gave me that like having to do recruitment, having to do like vendor management, having to do MDF applications and funding. So it gave me all these experiences of things that I hadn’t done as much in that role. with big companies like O2 and Vodafone obviously not CEO levels with a segment of their reseller partner network.
So I just did it because of the experience and the finance that it could obviously then bolster anything I wanted to do. So after I completed that project, I did a handful more of some freelance work with a couple of different people around Manchester. And then I was yeah, I’m ready to go now.
So I did. Vietnam. I had a friend that was living in Thailand, who I think you may have actually met or crossed paths with when you were at that other company looking for recruitment. And so he was like the foundation somewhat for me meeting other people when I arrived here, which I definitely think makes a difference to some people, even though I think Bangkok and Thailand is a really easy place to meet people in general.
It’s still nice to have someone you know who happens to actually be from that hometown. And yeah, that was the catalyst, was that I’d been traveling around Asia, really enjoyed the lifestyle, enjoyed the cuisine, and in England as well. And also I think it’s related to what, have you got at home?
And so like I have my family, which is still very important to me, but it wasn’t like I had a house or some like amazing career that I was just taking a sabbatical on or something to that effect. Like I didn’t have any real ties and then the other part of me where I took these risks to go to America or whatever, I think with Asia it’s almost you’re like, Oh, there’s not going to be jobs here for me.
And then actually when you start doing research, whether you want to go to Singapore, China, Ho Chi Minh, mainly the big, cities where there tends to be more job opportunities, there is jobs for, expats in different sectors now. It’s certain things like you couldn’t move to Thailand and start doing construction and plumbing or something.
So it really relates to what type of industries are protected and so forth as to how easy it is for you to make that move or make that leap and do that. But fortunately for me, did some marketing, most of those protected sectors. And so I managed to get a job. yeah, I haven’t got back since I
[00:25:19] Scott: So the, the working freelance, it sounds like, how old were you, when you changed and made that transition from working full time at that former employer to then working on that project for a while on a freelance basis? How old were you?
[00:25:30] Adam: think I was 20. 28 maybe, or like between 27 and 28. So I’ve been working in that other company for two years since I was maybe 25, 26, if I remember correctly. So it’s between turning 26, maybe, or maybe I just turned 26. and so I think I did the freelance project for nearly a year, maybe six to nine months, and then a handful of months doing support for those other contracts I mentioned.
Maybe a full year. Between the age of 28 to 29, and then from 29 to 30 was when I was traveling and then moving back to England to save some more cash to then start my job in Thailand. So basically when I turned 30, was my, basically when I just started working at Pronto. So I was freelance at 28 years old.
So I’m starting a very long road that way.
[00:26:31] Scott: Yeah, no, That’s interesting though. I just wonder whether or not that gave you some additional courage. Because, I don’t know about you, but when I was working for a, a larger consulting firm, then I got used to that stability of the paycheck and the tax forms and I just, everything is just taken care of.
it’s the standard, Path, right? That you, take after graduation or whatever, but I think that some people have a hesitant or hesitant to make a leap to, being able to work for yourself. and freelancing. It sounds like you had a pretty nice transition there because when you’re working with an employer that trust you already and then you’re working freelance for them, then you’re probably getting some level of encouragement of Oh, I can actually make money.
On a project based basis, and the world doesn’t fall apart. did you, do you feel you built up some, some confidence there when you started doing some of that freelance stuff?
[00:27:20] Adam: Yeah. I would say in one way I had confidence because there was almost like no risk associated with it because I knew I was going to go traveling. And so it was just like an extra, cash, extra thing to do before I knew I was definitely going to go rather than say, I’m going to take this project.
And now I know I have to get another three projects to last out another. 12 months or 18 months. So I didn’t really have a run road that I needed to hit, which I think made me wouldn’t say if I had something like that being the scenario, I may have been a bit more reserved or apprehensive about making that leap, but because, but it ultimately after completing the project, it definitely gave me that type of confidence that I feel like I could go and do that.
And also, I understand there’s other businesses with these types of challenges and being understand how to investigate and start creating cases for doing stuff, which was pretty much like a digital transformation project. and so it gave me more of a deeper understanding or peeled back the floorboards on the commercial aspect, which I think when sometimes you’re in marketing, like campaign strategist, coordinator, execution.
You’re not always so in alignment with the the business and the ROI and the investment and what we need to get back on it because you’re doing a piece of the picture rather than the broader picture. And so that’s where, it was also good. That’s what gave me that confidence that, okay, I can actually get a deeper understanding, create an evidence case, communicate that to a business, get buy in.
deliver it and then have them be happy at the end of it and ultimately then also I did more projects with the freelancer who I hired and so it just shows you that network effect that you can create just sometimes from doing that one project and building a portfolio. Yeah,
[00:29:27] Scott: So you described this as, a transformation and I’m imagining though, that, with sales, it’s like some salespeople might just want to sell something and they can’t really have the down to earth conversation, like you have as a leader or as a business owner, or where you’re thinking about the cost, where you’re thinking about the ROI, where you’re thinking, right?
And so it really sounds like you built up, that understanding, the bigger picture view, the business owner, the entrepreneur view, which is like you said, it’s, Somewhat rare. I think, some people do live in their silos. and since you understand that it’s probably easier for you to have some conversations around those areas.
now let’s fast forward a little bit more. you had mentioned some areas in some cities that have job opportunities, right? So Ho Chi Minh and some of the other areas in Southeast Asia, Singapore, obviously. what made you decide on Bangkok for not settling? Because I still know that you’re not exactly, you don’t have some house and family and everything like that right now in Thailand.
but you’ve been here for a few years, right? what helped you make that decision?
[00:30:29] Adam: I think because I’ve been traveling through Vietnam and Cambodia and Thailand I probably I lived actually in Vietnam. There was a period where I just tried to do this sort of like furniture business with a Dutch guy I met. it didn’t really go to plan. It wasn’t something that like broke me financially.
And I actually did learn some stuff just like with anything. about negotiating and procurement in Vietnamese. and building stuff as well. So we were actually doing some construction and things, It wasn’t how it maybe how I saw it going, but that was part of maybe why I didn’t want to go back to Vietnam as I need to get away from Vietnam and have a break in Thailand.
But I had, more friends in Thailand, so I had there was people that I’d met when I’d been here who lived here who I’d struck up relationships with. My friend who just moved here, had been living here permanently. and then just the I love the islands and the accessibility of going to different places around Thailand.
and yeah, I love, I actually just went to Ho Chi Minh this weekend just for a holiday because I’ve not been back for a while. so the reason I settled on Bangkok was, because of the, probably the relationship and the friends that I had here, just a preference for Thailand. But probably Vietnam was a close second.
And I’ve not been to Singapore. And I’ve visited places like Bali, since, but I think in general for Thailand, for foreigners, it, it’s fairly open, and there’s other types of things you could do if you have like capital, you could potentially buy houses or apartments and rent them out, and that could be part of your, own real estate person, so then you could then live here, so there’s ways that you could live here that don’t always have to just be focused on like a job or employment, but for me.
Good job opportunity and having a good base of friends there.
[00:32:38] Scott: Got it. So then how did you land that first job? Because, I assume you came in on tourist visa and, you can extend it or whatever else. But, the one challenge that does come up for people to be aware of is that you can’t do that forever. some people do this whole, hopping across the borders for, years or whatever, just going back and forth trying to extend their visas.
But there’s a lot of, yeah. Whereas if, government policies change or if they don’t want to renew you for the sixth time in a row, you’re now caught on the border, caught on the border and you can’t even come back in. So there are some challenges there. So there’s a benefit to having a work permit.
so I’m curious. was that one of your motivators? Was it just going to, did you need to get some income at some point? Were you, you just wanted to be able to stay here longer? So it’s, worth going through that path. And how was that transition to you, to actually having a longer term, job, in Thailand?
[00:33:26] Speaker 2: Yeah, I hadn’t really ever considered
[00:33:28] Adam: doing the whole like working under the radar kind of thing like I did. I knew other people had work permits there and had decent jobs and recruitment or whatever it be. And so that same vein, whether it be a long shot or whatever, or just like belief that Hey, I can get a job here because other people are doing it.
But then I did get a slight in, so I’m not going to say I was completely, there was a slight bit of nepotism. what, person that worked at Pronto knew a friend of mine and they opened up the role. And now other people did also apply for the role and interviewed for the role, but ultimately I ended up getting it.
and so that would be, one route, in, and that’s why I ended up with the work permit. but I think there is It all depends on what your skill set is. there’s international businesses that exist in Thailand where you could be part of the French outfit or outfit in the UK or the USA, and you can get a job and get a work permit that way, so there’s ways you can, if you’re overseas now, you can, you work for these big type of corporations, you can see what type of presence they have in these other major metropolises in across Southeast Asia.
or you can go to the route I went or other people went where. You land on a flight, and you get your CV out, and you start doing interviews, and then you then have to go back to your own country or a different country to get, all the embassy stuff processed.
[00:35:05] Scott: Got it. But you started applying once you were already here. Is that right?
[00:35:09] Adam: I was sending applications while I was still moving around when I was in Vietnam, but yeah, I came then to do interviews here after, so I flew from Hanoi into Bangkok. I had actually done a couple interviews in Vietnam as well. I had thought about doing English teaching, but I really just wanted to carry on doing marketing.
Like I didn’t want to like pivot out of it. I’d already pivoted doing that furniture thing. I had some egg on my face from it. So I was like, I’m gonna stick to what I know and what I think I do well. And just wanted to move into more of a commercially focused role, the same way I’d done with the project management and seeing what Was there opportunities like that, rather than say in the past in marketing, I’ve been always doing more like content campaign management, SEO, content writing, whatever it be, I wanted to continue to move more into the account management sales aspect.
[00:36:12] Scott: Got it. And then when you were, so you got, the job and you got, a sales position, or I guess it may be more of an account management that turned into more of a sales position or something. so you were applying. How was that transition for you? Because remember you, you started, we started with the whole, sales and journalism and the background of all of that, but had you always anticipated that you’re removing the sales?
Because what I got is journalism, sports, marketing, SEO, project management, right? freelancing. So was this your first, stop into more of a sales position then? and if so, how did you find that transition?
[00:36:49] Adam: Yeah, it was definitely the first role. I’ve had some roles in the past where I was doing like lead gen. There’d be some bonuses attached to. My ability is to generate leads for the sales team. And so I’ve had some commercially incentivized, compensation type packages or on target earnings, whatever you’d like to call it in the past, but not to the effect where, sales is, where it’s a little bit more.
Very much driven about how much value can you create from an account potentially. So that was my first experience, doing that and getting people. It’s a sign on the dotted line, so to speak. So yeah, that was my first exposure. I like I said, I’ve done that freelance project where I was getting a buy in, but the company was already been soft sold by me when I was in internally working for them.
And so this is where now you’re picking up someone that you’ve never spoken to. Who’s just working, you’re only just, been at the company for two weeks or whatever, three weeks. I know you speak to someone about that website. We’ve only known for two minutes, and you’ve got to create, and it’s just the same way with that project, create a use case for why they should make an investment in this and then using data to create that story and make it compelling and then trying to make them financially understand why it’s worth the investment on whether that’s a short term, medium term, long term kind of goals of the campaign.
So that was new to me. I didn’t really have any past training. I probably wasn’t as knowledgeable now as I am now, where I would have been like, I’m going to go read these 20 sales books and go watch these podcasts and stuff like that, because it wasn’t as readily available as it probably is now in 2023, that all these materials will pop up on TikTok and Instagram on any kind of post.
and so I was very much learning it on my feet rather than from someone else. And some of that could be good, but I do think having more. Structured learning mechanism is ultimately better to get to the goal that you want faster.
[00:39:05] Scott: yeah, it’s interesting that you made that transition though, and you, the fact that you’d worked in tech and you worked in marketing and you’ve worked in some of these other areas, it seems like you had the skills that you needed, but it was just a matter of polishing around the edges, getting that other, soft skill of talking to people and convincing them to take an action.
But you had a pretty strong foundation in a lot of these other areas, which is really important. I want to run something past you though. So you had mentioned that you have some friends that worked in recruitment. you’d mentioned how in Thailand there are some protected, industries. So, just for people that don’t know, it’s some industries, you can’t be a foreigner working, let’s say in a restaurant, I believe, or some sort of food services because, Thailand wants to protect understandably, their local population to make sure that foreigners aren’t taking their jobs, that sort of thing.
you’d mentioned teaching. So the summary of the people that I know in this area is that, People either go into teaching is like that whole, that’s the one job that’ll always exist, but there’s a million people that are worked in other areas and then they can get a teaching job in Thailand.
They’ve got a little bit stricter about, having people that have university educations, but it is easy to get a teaching job, but it’s also understand that it’s very low salaries and it just teaching is not necessarily a fun job for people that aren’t really passionate about it. So teaching jobs are common one. sales jobs are another really common one. So recruitment and things like this are, you can do quite well because to your point, it’s commission based, right? So you can, make a really good salary. And I know some people that have done really well in Thailand making maybe more than they do in their home country, just because if they can sell on the phone, then you can do really well.
so there’s sales jobs, there’s marketing jobs, right? and you can work for marketing agencies that are based in Thailand, or you can do freelance and work as a marketer just from abroad where you’re doing that, anything that’s remote. Are there any sort of other. Have either friends or, people that have done really well in Thailand that have worked in some other industries, and have found a lot of success beyond those key ones.
[00:41:00] Adam: Yeah, there was a, I remember a French lad that Pierre knows, he’s called Thibaut. and I think it was his own company, and it was something, or maybe it was part owned by someone in Thailand as well, but it was to do with, manufacturing or some, process within the company. So I think there are even like left field things when you’ll speak to someone and they’ll tell you and you’re like, that’s so random, like how?
So I think there is it’s just like anything in the world. If you’ve got skillset or expertise to a really high level, there is going to be a 50 million or 100 million Thai company that might need you for a certain role within that, within product development or whatever. Yeah. So I think there are other industries that I don’t have any knowledge about where people’s skills could be utilized, but it’d be like, how do you find that job?
How do you find that in with that company? How do you even understand if they’re developing a product or whatever, that you would be a great project leader for us? And there’s all these other things that you have to consider. And I think the language barrier is definitely a challenge in some of these other sectors where you’re potentially working with people.
Thai employees as well, so you might have to have a better grasp of Thai to facilitate a good delivery of a project, because obviously what we’re doing is pretty much all English driven and with English audience, and not local market. So I think there’s other things you can always consider as well to, like, how easy it would be for you to transition into a job here.
[00:42:36] Scott: Yeah, that’s a really good point. the specialization and. Yeah, I guess there, there are always big things like, there’s construction where it’s some, French and German company or whatever that working together on some big construction project or whatever. And you need someone who’s really specialized in, train building or whatever it is, right?
so people with specialized skills can do really well, but I’d assume that a lot of those are people that those large multinational organizations are. Probably importing those people in and getting them on an expat salary. It’s sometimes a little bit harder to say, I have a specialized skill. I’m going to land on the ground and then work in that specialized skill.
And that’s where I’m just going to go back to what you’ve done. you didn’t have, again, a purely sales background, but the fact that you built up your sales skills, that is. I don’t know. I think that’s a huge advantage. Anyone who’s willing and capable to work in sales, if, they can, if they’re good at, if they have the skillset after having, polished that or honing that skillset, That still seems like one of the best cheat codes in my opinion, because it allows you to really work across different industries, ideally take advantage of the industry that you worked in the past and then, work a job that a lot of probably Thai people wouldn’t really want to work to be honest.
and that actually touches on another thing is that you, work with primarily us clients, right? So there is also a time difference to account for. so how is that? How’s that work situation for you now? do you work late or night sometimes? and do you find anything challenging about that current setup or is it the cost that way, the benefits?
[00:44:02] Adam: Yeah, it’s definitely can be a risk reward, there’s some aspects where, I think in one way it’s great for me because it’s flexible. I actually like the fact that I can split my day into two half shifts. sometimes I would find in the UK, and it wouldn’t just be me, you can look around the office and you can see people lining the clock at 4:59 or whatever time is set for that particular business. or you can just see the people get burnt out by doing that eight to nine hours like straight slot with maybe a brief lunch break in between. So for me, it actually helps me, keeps me rejuvenated as well. The challenge could be that maybe there’s, I want to go do something on a weekday night and it’s someone’s birthday and they’re going out for a dinner and maybe I’ve got some important calls I want to take and I didn’t have the foresight because they let me know too late or something and I can’t really move anything around.
if I had a family or something, then I guess it could also, or children, maybe that could impact it. But, in general, because I’m working at night, from potentially 9:30 till, I try and clock off at 1am at the latest, but depending on the time zone, differences throughout the year, I could be a little bit later.
and I’ve just got, used to it, and actually enjoy what I do. I enjoy helping. Business owners understand marketing, I help, I enjoy finding like opportunities and wins that they can have and then seeing them eventually hopefully turn into case studies six or 12 months later and knowing that okay I didn’t do all the campaign execution and see everything through but I helped get the ball rolling and helped identify some opportunity and then obviously the great work from the rest of the team helped accomplish that for that client and then that client.
Potentially invest in more services or bring those referrals or whatever it be. So I think there’s, if it was, I’ve had to stay up and do something that I hated, then obviously I would just wouldn’t do it. I would go and get a different job. but because I enjoy it, I, even when sometimes it’s not a great lead or, whatever, the rough comes with the smooth, it’s just part and parcel of the job.
so yeah, I, it’s, it can be challenging. For some people to be like, I don’t understand. How you can be engaged at that time at night, it’s someone else’s morning, right? And they’ve just had their cup of coffee. They’ve just finished their first meeting and they’re like, ready to talk business.
And then for me, it’s like my last call of the night. And I’m like, what am I watching Netflix for half an hour before I fall asleep? That’s the transition in where we are at time of the day. and so I think for some people, it’s more of a surprise that I would be able to
I don’t get up at, 7 a. m. and do a yoga session under the sunrise or whatever like someone else might do,
[00:47:04] Scott: Yeah, no, that makes perfect sense. And it still sounds like a really good balance because when you just mention maybe staying up for a 1:00 A.M. call, as you said, you’re probably not going to be super, bright eye and bushy tail at that time. But at the same time, that’s still not terribly late, right?
some people do, watch Netflix until 1 a. m. and you’re, but you’re, working during that time. And that’s totally fair. the other thing that comes to mind here is, We’ve talked a lot about how you built up that skill set in sales and It seems really powerful that you really like helping the business owner accomplish their end goal because you’re, very well rounded, right?
So I do know some salespeople that just have the skill set in sales. And if there’s a technical challenge, if there’s a marketing challenge, if there’s anything else like that’s out of sight, out of mind for them, they can’t handle that. Whereas you’ve built up that strong foundation in those areas.
And so now you can have a well rounded conversation. Now you actually really want to help them and you’re not just looking to sell something and then move on because you, it sounds like you really have a, I don’t know, a connection to the people that you talk to. You actually care that you’re actually helping the people that you talk to, which I’d say comes across very much in a sales call because you’re not just a typical salesperson that just wants to pitch them something right.
[00:48:14] Adam: Yeah. if you’re going to get on a call with someone for half an hour, and it’s already booked, there’s no point not providing any value, even if they’re maybe not a good fit or they don’t have the budget or something like that. There’s always something you can help them with, like someone that came in yesterday.
And, they may end up purchasing, but probably not immediately from what it sounded like. She’s got to make a case to the business owner, and she’s getting quotes from different people. And then I noticed that like their GMB categories were all set up incorrectly for a managed service provider.
And that’s just adding a little bit of value that might help them accomplish their goals in short, medium, long term. Didn’t cost me anything, cost them anything to accomplish it and create a good precedent for maybe when they do want to receive a proposal for, me, I’ve got a little bit more of a competitive edge over someone else.
And yes, that was somewhat sales oriented in the back of my mind, right? There was always this ulterior motive you could say to bring in more revenue for pronto, but I was also providing value for nothing at that time. So I think that’s It’s like just sowing good seeds, just doing good deeds that will hopefully pay dividends in the future,
[00:49:33] Scott: And just to unpack that, the acronym GMB, Google My Business, right? So that’s a business that, has a map listing on Google Maps and there are ways that you can optimize that to make sure that you have increased visibility. And when people are searching for that thing, then your listing is there.
And that’s something that potentially someone can do for free or a business can do for free. It’s not a service, but Adam’s point, it’s this, Idea of just doing whatever’s right. okay, if you don’t have much money, you don’t have much budget. That’s totally fine. You want to help that individual and you’re going to give them some, ideas on how to make some improvements.
And when you said all that, it reminded me a lot of a real estate agent, right? So real estate agent, a good one, is probably networking a lot, talking a lot, trying to help people, trying to be their friend. but they’re not just looking to, can I sell this person, this house, this month, it might be something that comes around a year later.
It could be someone’s friend that, That, that needs a house and they think of that person. So you play the long game. It sounds
[00:50:23] Adam: Yeah, exactly. Try and understand where a customer is in their life cycle. And, it’s a lot of that’s just doing the questions and answers. someone has got an SEO agency and they’re doing a bad job. then I can go for the jugular and start pointing out all the things that are wrong and then show how our pricing is more competitive and how they get more value.
But then if it’s someone else who is not in that frame of mind, it’s as I just said, they’re more shopping around and they don’t really know what they’re searching for. Then I can do some more like soft sell where I can provide some free value and tips that will have hopefully an impact on them.
And then in six months when they’re ready. They’ll be like, okay, that guy knows what he’s talking about. I’m going to go back
[00:51:12] Scott: Absolutely. So we’ve talked a lot about work. I’m curious since you’ve been here for a few years now. what are the things that you enjoy about Thailand, whether that be through leisure time or whatever, because it sounds like you’ve really worked out a good way to take late night calls and, and, work hard during those hours, but you still, you’re into sports, you’re into some other things.
So what things do you enjoy in Thailand outside of the work?
[00:51:38] Adam: athletics. I’ve got one friend that I play tennis with occasionally. I’ve not played in a while, but like this, we can pretty much do everything in Bangkok or even in Thailand and the regions, right? So I like sports, outdoors. And so for me, the weather, obviously it’s raining right now, but most of the time, even for a period of today, it was very nice weather.
You can always go out and do stuff in England. That’s, challenging in Wisconsin. It was definitely challenging for four months of the year. And so for me, that’s why I like Thailand is that if I want to go and stroll along the beach, if I’m living on that region, just have a relaxed day, I can go do that.
If I don’t want to stroll along, it’s a cool day that you get. Pollution in my face, I could go and do that. I put it, the weather would be nice and it’d be bustling and there’s activity going on, so I feel like just the climate and the cost of living, the people, the outlook of people’s life just, it’s also really safe.
Like I’ve been, it’s one, I just was traveling in Peru, Columbia and South America last year, and that was a great experience, but definitely felt a little bit, Less safe than Thailand or Bangkok, even, and even that comparing that to the UK, I feel like Thailand is infinitely safer. and you can leave a phone in a taxi and someone would go drive 15 kilometers after the end of the shift to give it to you.
And you wouldn’t even, refuse to take a bath until you literally, forced it into the hand. It’s those kinds of people there. So I think that’s another reason as well, why it’s. Good. If you want to be an expat who’s single and just want to enjoy your free time all the way to, you’ve got a family and you’re concerned about safety and other things, I think it’s good in that respect.
[00:53:35] Scott: Yeah, absolutely. It’s a really good point that, there. There is a culture here of people are more relaxed, a little, which in a way you can stand out if you’re a little bit less relaxed and you’re really hard working or work really late hours, whatever, not to say that there aren’t people that do that here too, but I’m just saying you can stand out in that regard, but then you also just have people that are just seem content, just seem happy like they’re gonna, Do the street food or their cook street food all day, or they’re gonna, take care of the gardens and just a lot of people seem content and just, they go along and like you said, we’ll go above and beyond as for strangers here, right?
it’s maybe not as extreme as in some areas, but the whole, you drop something on the ground, a lot of people are going to pick it up and give it to you, right? they’re not going to grab it and put it in their pocket. so, there’s a lot of really kind people here as well. now what about, Okay.
What about your recommendation to anyone who’s thinking about coming to Thailand? Do you have any sort of opinions on, any misconceptions or any good reasons that you would say to come here? What are your, what’s your advice to others?
[00:54:41] Adam: I, wanted to come here because I felt like where I was in the UK, there wasn’t like that much for me. if I probably wanted to do, get further on the career ladder, we’d either go in the UK or in the UK. Completely freelance and doing more projects or maybe moving to London and trying to get like a bigger agency or chief marketing officer type job.
A lot of my friends had moved to Australia or living in Dubai or living in Thailand or had kids in the family. And so I was, I’ve gotten to gravitate one way or the other. And so that’s why I took the leap. So I think there’s. scenario or situational things that could be why you want to make that leap of faith.
And then also just your age, like if you’re young, I would just definitely go and do it. If you’re looking for an opportunity for even a year or two to then even go back to your home country. I moved out here when I was older, but you can easily do it when you’re younger. and so for me, if you’re just not, Totally enamored with where you are in life at home.
You don’t have to, just start researching. go on, look at podcasts like this or other types of, content you can go and view on YouTube. Articles, look at businesses that operate here and see if your skill sets align with them. And then decide if it’s something for you, I think.
It shouldn’t be, you should always feel like you can go back home and restart if you ever have to.
[00:56:17] Scott: Yeah, I think that’s a really good point too, that some people retire here and obviously your money can usually go further in Thailand than it would maybe in your home country, but. Sometimes there’s a negative light put on the idea of, Oh, you’re just going to Thailand. You’re just going to sit on the beach and do nothing.
And I would argue that you can actually continue your career here as you have done. So it seems like what you’re doing now in your career wasn’t exactly Oh, I just started. I don’t like teaching, but I’m teaching there just so I can get enough money to pay rent. It sounds like the skill sets that you are building on are actually part of that career path.
So UK at some point in the future or not, it’s not exactly what have you done for the last few years? Oh, I was just sitting. drinking Mai Tais is like you were actually doing work, working late hours and building a skill set.
[00:56:59] Adam: Yeah. And that’s it. It could be, as you said, that obviously the point of the podcast is, to thrive in Thailand and there is that aspect of it where at a certain stage in your life and you get the right opportunity and you can grab it, the bull by the horns and make it your own. And there could be a point where in life you’re still feeling out what you want to do and the experience of being in Thailand makes you go back to your home country and then Work your arse off and get the skills to then get the better job later on, or make some capital that allows you to buy a house here, or invest and set up your own little business, like whatever it is, right?
Just having something that gives you the exposure to be the catalyst to create that drive to be successful here. It just depends on when you land here,
[00:57:49] Scott: Yeah. And one thing additional to piggyback off that is money can go very far here, but it can also go very quickly here. So there are plenty of people that save up for, let’s say, retirement in the UK or the US and come here and within, months or years, all their money’s gone. That can absolutely happen.
You can actually get rid of your money very quickly. So I think it’s a really good, if you have the ability to come here and. make money, then you’re going to be in a much better position. It’s the same of anything. Cashflow, right? As long as you have cashflow, then you’re going to do okay. So as long as you’re not depleting your retirement forever, as long as you’re not, something’s coming in and you’re building something here.
and it’s a little bit harder, I’d argue for the first couple of months. if you don’t have that first job, then, It’s sometimes hard to get that first job because there are a lot of people applying for jobs, right? But once you get that first job and once you’ve proven, Oh yeah, you’re going to stick around.
You can work hard for a year. You’re not just here for holiday. You’re actually here to get some income and to do a good job. then it’s a little bit easier to get the second job or to, take some parallel move or to move up the corporate ladder in the company if you like the company a lot or whatever.
but yeah, sometimes that first move with that first job, that first income can be a little bit tough, but, then it can be good from there. once you’ve proven yourself.
[00:58:55] Adam: Yeah.
[00:58:57] Scott: go
[00:58:57] Adam: to say my friend, he’s moved through several recruitment jobs, in different types of companies, and he’s always succeeded and it was that first, job. And his initial job was doing more project management and it was actually like working through that with just some company and some help with Netflix.
And so he made the transition into project management, into, sales ultimately. So you said it’s about getting. Your first job, the first visa, the work permit, getting some credibility and then you can network and you’ve got all these other things, these opportunities that may present to you just by being present in Bangkok that you wouldn’t get by looking on Indeed, thousands of miles away.
[00:59:43] Scott: Yeah, absolutely. So one of the last questions for you. what are your plans for the future? you Adam, you’d mentioned that you had this entrepreneurial side of things. You’re, starting furniture stuff in, in, Vietnam. but what sort of big plans or ideas you have for the coming years?
[01:00:01] Adam: I’d like to have, like a side project business, whether that be like digital whether product based, whether that be in. 20 years time, I’ve made enough money, I decided I’m just going to power up a little cafe on a Samui beach and serve bacon butties and do some freelance GMB management. I, I don’t really know that far ahead.
At the moment I just want to really hone in on, on building what I’m doing up at Fronto in terms of helping us drive more revenue and build the company, or, And from a, my own perspective, yeah, trying to determine what type of side project I would like to do, whether that be freelance and moving into a consulting, whether that be a different sales role in a different industry, that should be, freelance.
I haven’t got anything, firm, but some loose irons in the fire is probably, more common. I think for me, it’s more determining like where I see myself living. I always, I feel like I can, if I’m going to continue doing remote work, I can work with people in the States, in Australia, if I’m on that side of it, it’s more the understanding of visas, like where could I live, where I’d be closer to my family in the future, potentially, that would also allow me to have a visa, that would allow me to have, own a property that I would live, like all these other aspects.
If I wasn’t to live in Thailand, they are the things that are more of an issue for me. From a working standpoint, I feel like I’m always going to be somewhat involved in marketing and digital. If the industry exists and isn’t taken over by AI robots, that’s where I’m planning to stay.
[01:01:52] Scott: Awesome. the last thing, what is the best way to get in touch with you? If there’s someone from your hometown, that’s trying to make the move out to Thailand, or if it’s someone on the, maybe the marketing or SEO or sales side of things that wants to reach out to you, what’s, what’s your best contact?
[01:02:07] Adam: I should probably get more personal brand stuff like my own domain and all these other things that I know you have. So I would have to say go for LinkedIn, message me on LinkedIn, Adam Porteous of course it should should show that I’m based in Bangkok, Thailand. and then yeah, you can always go to Pronto Marketing and fill in a contact us form.
You’ll probably likely end up speaking to me as well, if you can’t find my LinkedIn profile.
[01:02:35] Scott: Perfect. thank you so much for the time, Adam. It’s been a pleasure. I learned a lot of things I didn’t know after knowing you for a few years. thank you so much for taking the time and, we’ll chat soon.
[01:02:44] Adam: Yeah, it was a pleasure.
[01:02:45] Scott: Well, there you have it. Adam’s story shows us the importance of taking bold steps, building a wide ranging skill set, and the value of forming meaningful professional connections. I hope you learned something, and I’ll catch you on the next one.
